YES!!! It lives...well sort of - help.

[stoic]

matt

I just checked the manuel and it shows the regulator you should have in Volume 3 Electrical . Look on page 31-10-02 .

Yours should be the TOP drawing. The wire from the ignition should be a Green wire with a Red Stripe. On the plug that goes on the regulator there should be 3 wires and the plug (Ibelieve) or the regulator should be marked A +, S and then F. You want the wire marked 'S' . Without hooking the other end of the wire to the coil just hook the positive of a voltmeter to it and connect the negative of the voltmeter to a good ground. There should be 12 volts with the key turned to 'Run' and NO voltage with the key turned 'Off". I said earlier that it should be a Red wire with a Green stripe from your post saying that about your ignition switch.

If you get the wire turning on and off with the ignition switch then splice it onto the old wires that went to the positive post of the coil. I believe originally there was just one wire that went onto the + post of the coil. This wire then went and branched into two wires. One went to the starting solenoid and the other went to the resistor wire and then to the ignition key. Anyhow, hook the old wire to the new wire because otherwise, the coil won't receive any voltage when you're trying to start the car.

I just looked at the drawing of the voltage regulator again and it shows a yellow wire going to A+ on the plug, a green-red stripe wire going to 'S' and an orange wire going to 'F'. Is that what is on your regulator? If it is and without the new wire connected to anything BUT a voltmeter it should only read 12 volts with the key in 'Run". Check that plug and the color on the wires at the regulator again. Also, if the car won't shutoff again pull the wire that goes to the + on the coil. It is only 12 volts. The center wire on the distributor and the sparkplug wires can give you a shock. Usually nothing serious though unless you have a pacemaker or a bad heart !!

I'll try and check this site earlier tomorrow. Hope you get it running and it DOSEN'T shut down again after 20 or 30 minutes.

[action]

Matt,

Amoung other things ------

Do not stop your car by removing any battery cable, unless it's an emergency. The voltage spike that occurs, may take out your alternator and/or if you have an electronic regulator it may take that out as well.

The same kinda thing applies to the dist/coil wire. With electronic ignition, removing the coil wire and not gounding it (And your body does not count) you may damage the system. I am not familar with the pertronix application, with the Ford Duraspark or most of the EEC systems an ungrounded secondary system puts a strain on the electronics as they are trying to build up enough grunt to create a spark to jump the gap. In this case the gap may be 1 to 4 feet. The system was not designed for that.

At least remove the wire to the regulator that you attached. This is how the system was designed to stop the engine. To cut power to the coil.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action

[sgt art]

with Pertronix, there are two wires to hook up. One goes to the positive side of the coil, the other to the negative side. The 12 volt power source or feed for the primary system, hooks up to the positive side of the of the coil. That's it. By removing the 12 volt source from the positive side of the coil it's no different than turning off the key. In fact, you could run a wire from the positive post on your battery to your coil (positive post) with a toggle switch to turn power to it on or off. Switch on, turn key to crank engine and you should start up. To kill the engine, switch off and turn off the key to shut down power to everything else. Crude, but it will work.

[matt.shaver]

Ok Everyone...

I have found my problem. I did not splice into the correct wire. It would appear that I have spliced into the "Field Coil Terminal" wire. This is an orange wire that looked red when I was in the garage. It happens to be the "F" in Alternator Regulator/Voltage Regulator.

I was looking to see where this goes and if I'm looking at the correct wiring diagram, it's going back to the Alternator. Well I can see why the car won't stop.

I'm learning to read this wiring diagram, and like you all have said the Green - Red wire goes backs to the ignition switch. So I'll have to uncrimp my connection and crimp the green/red wire instead. I have already ran that cable into the ignition wire going to the "+" of the coil.

Right now it's 97 degrees out and I'll wait another hour and go out to uncrimp the wire, tap into the "S" wire on the voltage regulator. Check out via a multimeter for the on/off situation. If I don't get voltage on the "Off" position, I'm home free.

Right now you could cook a good New York strip on the sidewalk. Think I'll stay in for just right now. My garage is not ACed, so I'll give it an hour.

Thanks so much,
Matt

[8Track Sinatra]

MMMM, new york strip... Why not have one while waiting, steak is brain food after all. It might help put all this in perspective. If not, at least you won't be hungry.

[action]

I think carpenters have a saying for this ........

Measure twice and cut once.

Anyway glad to know that you have found a solution.



97 is a great temp for AZ at this time of year. It sucks @ 103 and 45% humidity. Oh for the days of single digit humidity.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action

[matt.shaver]

Ok everyone...

What I have done is to disconnect the wire and retap it into the wire going to the ignition. The other end of the wire is spliced into the ignition wire going to the + side of the ignition coil, not to the coil itself.

After starting the car, I'm getting 11.85 volts much less than before, however when I turn the car off, it's off - that's a plus on many sides.

Do I need to take the tap off of the ignition side and run it directly to the coil or leave it tapped where it is.

I'd really like to get 12 - 14 volts while 11.85 is just not cutting it. Do you think I need to make sure my tapped connection is solid? Would that make such a difference?

Thoughts?
Matt

[sgt art]

ntxt

[matt.shaver]

Everyone,

I wanted to do some additional diagnosis on my 71 Mark III. What I did was connect the volt meter to the actual wire I was tapping into.

Using the crimping tap type connector, I rigged up another harness type device to measure the voltage.

In my thinking I thought perhaps I was hastily working but after connecting the voltmeter into wire, I am still getting 11.75 - 11.5 volts. So it was not my wiring skills or lack there of. If I'm reading this correct, that wire is not getting a full 12 volts.

Any suggestions or thoughts that you all might have??
Puzzled Matt

[drcliff]

In my thinking I thought perhaps I was hastily working but after connecting the voltmeter into wire, I am still getting 11.75 - 11.5 volts. So it was not my wiring skills or lack there of. If I'm reading this correct, that wire is not getting a full 12 volts.

matt- cliff davis here. i talked to you a while back when you were selling your 64 (i think).

"12 volts" is kind of a figure of speech, you never really find a perfect 12 volts anywhere.
you might measure 10.5 or 11.5 across a naked battery, the charge circuit might deliver 13 or 14 volts when the car's running, and the system voltage might drop to 7 or 8 volts during starting. so i think with very few exceptions, not seeing exactly 12 volts is not a cause for concern.
your haynes manual might mention 'typical' voltages measured at various locations & conditions in a healthy system. hope this puts you at ease.

[matt.shaver]

Then is this OK to have this connected this way? And leave it??

the volt meter is not bobbing up and down, it's very consistent and the needle is not moving back and forth as it did before.

Matt

[action]

What is the voltage at the battery?
Then what is the voltage at the coil?

Each of the above under the same circumstances, you have solved for voltage drop. If the difference is a couple of tenths then drop is OK. If there is more than that the drop is a bit excessive.

Engine not running open battery voltage of just a smidge over 12 would be a fully charged battery. I think at about 12.6. (with an accurate and calibrated meter) With the engine running after a minute or two I would expect to see voltage of about 13 high not to exceed 14 at the battery. Then I would say your charging system is good and the battery is good. During cranking I would not want to see the voltage slip below 10 volts (9.6) at the battery.

So given the above, the voltage at the coil should be 3 or 4 tenths less with all of the connections. Will the car preform with less? Don't know because of the Pertronix requirements. On a cold damp morning with old and heavy oil on old spark plugs would it start? - that would be the test.

If you have more than 3 or 4 tenths of voltage drop you have some resistance that is getting in to way. Dirt or moisture in connections, tapped into part of the resistance wire, too small gauge wire for the distance, or ????? And it may not make that much difference for Pertronix.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>Action

[sgt art]

Check the voltage at the battery to see if your meter is correctly calibrated. A healthy battery should read 12.5 VDC. Once you've established that your meter is correct or possibly incorrect (I have an analog meter that reads about 1.5 volts low - I confirmed this by comparing it to two other meters, one analog and the other digital) start probing for a battery voltage reading.

You want battery voltage when the key is in both the RUN and START position with no voltage when the KEY is in the OFF position. That source of power should be the only wire going to the positive post on the coil. Your red wire from the Pertronix should also be there. The black wire from the Pertronix should be on the negative post of coil. The wire from the center of the coid to the center of the distributor is the only other wire that should be on the coil. remove any others. The old power source (resistor wire should be taped up and put off the side. It will still be hot when you start and run the car, so make sure it can't short out against the block.

Seriously, if you can't do the above, I would urge you to get some help. Otherwise, you risk frying a $90 + Pertronix unit.

Note: If you really only have 11.5 VDC at the battery(engine off); your battery is weak. Check for dry cells, one dry cell will kill a battery, I've had this happen.

[matt.shaver]

Action,

I'm at the office but will start the car up this afternoon and take a couple measurements.

I did check the voltage on the battery when the car is not running and it's 12.36 volts. However, I didn't check it when it was running. I'll do that.

I think it was stoic that mentioned running a connection directly from the battery to the ignition coil with a toggle switch in between. I've geen giving that serious thought too.

However, my wife has now mentioned this morning at breakfast that I might want to take to the shop before I really mess up the wiring.

I had a complete wiring schematic but after our move, I cannot find it and have looked everywhere. I did get another one on eBay last night.

At any rate, I'll measure tonight and see what happens.
Matt

[matt.shaver]

Hey everyone...here's a tidbit of information.

I called and talk to technical support at Pertronix. I asked how much voltage should I be getting to their coil. They told me anything above 8 volts and the coil will work just fine.

I explained I was getting 11.75 and he told me that both the FlameThrower coil and the electronic ignition will work with the car.

As Scotty from Star Trek might say, now I can take her out for a shake down.

I'll let you all know what she does...I'm crossing all my fingers, wearing a couple dozen rabbit feet and avoiding all black cats and ladders. LOL.

Thanks so much guys, hopefully we'll end this 8 page dialog...Matt