WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby cliffdavis » Wed Oct 05, 2011 9:34 pm

There's a lot of wiggle-room for everybody to be 'right'. If you want to rebuild and modernize your MEL motor, do it. If you want to shoehorn a 460/C6 into place, do it. If you want a Coyote motor, do it. Ford is going to great lengths to produce turn-key EFI crate-motor Coyotes so that job would be easier than you might think. Our cars have Dana 53 rear axles, which are oddballs but gearsets are still available. A Coyote spinning 3.73s would move the car nicely. I've even seen an LS1 motor under the hood. What's 'right', is what's right for you.

I've spent a lot of time researching a 460 swap for my 64, and the short answer is this. If you're an experienced engine-swap kind of guy, it's not an especially difficult swap. Use the donor for everything from the water pump to the tailshaft. Like most swaps, you'll fab the motor mount rests and a driveshaft (no biggie). You'll need a specific Continental 460 front cover so you can keep the crank-mounted p/s pump. Solid-mount your steering box (forum member john brewer has handy kits for this) so you can run the exhaust real close and not have them collide.

I hope this helps, from one old mechanic to another, but I do take exception to your claim that a combustion chamber 'in the piston' is inefficient. The chamber is a theoretical, dynamic space, and one wall is always in the piston, and one wall is always in the head. The fuel doesn't know or care where it is. I'll also point out that nearly every diesel engine ever made, including the modern Cummins and Duramax pickup motors that can easily make 1,000 ft-lbs of torque and NO SMOKE, have the chambers 'in the piston'.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby Dan Szwarc » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:02 am

I'm all for putting a 460 into a 60s Lincoln. There are a lot of posts on this forum of people who have discussed it and possibly done it. One just has to find them.

Someone had custom exhaust headers on his 62 (I think) for a 460 install.

We have previously determined that the frame has to be notched on an angle for the 460 to fit. They did this in 1969. The 460 uses special motor mounts for 1969 only (hard to find) that fit the continental. They probably would fit a 62. Otherwise, make your own.

You have to use a C6 transmission from a 66 to 69 Continental to clear the HVAC box. 62 may not fit. You cannot use a C6 from a Mark III or a 70s or new Lincoln. Too round.

Searching is difficult because the keywords are too common. 460 is in damn near any post about any 69 to 78 Lincoln. You have to search carefully. You have to read to weed out the posts that are not what you want.

The search engine is great. You just have to think about what people post and what words they use.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby Dan Szwarc » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:08 am

This is probably the most useful post you will find:
460 In a Slabside!!
It's a 61.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby 1970ls5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 10:23 am

Dan, thanks for that link, it was very informative, I wonder if Loco ever got his swap completed and it would be nice to talk to him. The Aussie that did his swap sure did some nice work and the headers came out amazing. I will just be running stock exhaust manifolds and hope to fine a set that will clear everything, I should be able to do so. Dave
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby 1970ls5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:14 pm

cliffdavis wrote:There's a lot of wiggle-room for everybody to be 'right'. If you want to rebuild and modernize your MEL motor, do it. If you want to shoehorn a 460/C6 into place, do it. If you want a Coyote motor, do it. Ford is going to great lengths to produce turn-key EFI crate-motor Coyotes so that job would be easier than you might think. Our cars have Dana 53 rear axles, which are oddballs but gearsets are still available. A Coyote spinning 3.73s would move the car nicely. I've even seen an LS1 motor under the hood. What's 'right', is what's right for you.

I've spent a lot of time researching a 460 swap for my 64, and the short answer is this. If you're an experienced engine-swap kind of guy, it's not an especially difficult swap. Use the donor for everything from the water pump to the tailshaft. Like most swaps, you'll fab the motor mount rests and a driveshaft (no biggie). You'll need a specific Continental 460 front cover so you can keep the crank-mounted p/s pump. Solid-mount your steering box (forum member john brewer has handy kits for this) so you can run the exhaust real close and not have them collide.

I hope this helps, from one old mechanic to another, but I do take exception to your claim that a combustion chamber 'in the piston' is inefficient. The chamber is a theoretical, dynamic space, and one wall is always in the piston, and one wall is always in the head. The fuel doesn't know or care where it is. I'll also point out that nearly every diesel engine ever made, including the modern Cummins and Duramax pickup motors that can easily make 1,000 ft-lbs of torque and NO SMOKE, have the chambers 'in the piston'.




Cliff, thanks for your note, lived in New Orleans for almost 8 years in the 60's, love the food, it is the best in the Country!, went to Rummel High and my buddy, Richard Gaudry, has a Linc also and he lives in New Orleans, must be the water.

I was the first commercial jet into Kenner after Katrina when I flew for UPS, my company sent me as I knew the layout and our hotel got blown down. I went downtown and saw that Mothers was still opened and I stayed at the hotel right across the street. I took my crew there and some of those guys were trying to order a hamburger!, I had to slap them upside the head and introduced them to Po-Boys, Roast Beef on French bread w/debirs, red beans and rice, Gumbo and then we walked down to the warf to get the French donuts! They are still talking about it!

I just changed the 3 biscut mounts for my steering box in my car and since I will not be running headers but exhaust manifolds I hopefully won't need the clearence. I will also be running a more modern powersteering pump on the engine and will just make up hoses to plum it in. Anything you can add will be appreciated and if you don't mind as the swap get closer I will PM you and call you real time. Thanks, Dave
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby Dan Szwarc » Thu Oct 06, 2011 2:20 pm

The posts are out there. You just have to find them.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby Wixomhead » Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:03 pm

310 HP turd


Uh, say what? One man's turd is another man's passion. Whataver, whatami, Shakespear?

Please tell me what you think


I think unless you are a millionaire married to the idea of owning a pristine slabside with a the modern Caddy Northstar V8 or Chrysler Hemi, you should rebuild your 430 bottom end and custom fab the top end with computerized injection and ignition and itunes.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby 1970ls5 » Thu Oct 06, 2011 5:32 pm

Head, there is no fixing that combustion chamber or the valve seats that are designed for leaded fuel, have you not read any of my posts or are you just shooting from the hip? I can understand that re-powering the vehicle would be hard for people that find changing batteries in a flashlight challenging but I am not one of those people (as I have said several times) and would be a piece of cake for me.

Do not need a "how to" on this swap, just wanted to ask on several forums if anyone had done the swap. I can assure you I will not be cutting the car up or damaging anything, I am 60 years old and a history buff and know I have a responsability to pass this car on intact with all the original equipment, it just will not be in the car but on the shelf when I or my family sells it when I pass, never been a fan of those guys that cut cars up to make thier "vision" that is not me and never will. As you can see from some of the threads Dan has posted it can be done and be done in a sanitary way, and that is how I will do it but with my experience as a car-crafter will try to take it to the next level, will not change the rear gear, I will get an over drive and I will get a lot better gas mileage with a LOT more power, less weight, and have a better car for it considering the enviorment. Dave
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby TonyC » Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:23 pm

Just for the record, the presence or absence of lead in the fuel is academic when you're talking about a MEL engine. They do not burn up valve seats and guides if you run unleaded fuel. They were huge, overbuilt, slow-turning engines that could easily overcome that "inconvenience." The one fuel-related handicap they did have was owner's ignorance by using too low an octane rating of fuel, causing serious knocking, chipping away pieces of metal from the cylinders and piston heads. Those engines were tuned-down high-performance engines, requiring a high octane.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby 1970ls5 » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:53 am

Huh?, please, you are not an authority just because you subscribe to this site, that is not true and octane qualtity has no bearing on the valve guides or seats but fuel sure does effect the bearings first and the pistons second! Lead when it was allowed cushioned and lubricated the valves as they contacted the seats and helped to transmit the heat the valves were exposed to into the cylinder head which with water flow was cooled. Have you ever heard the term "burnt valves?", this could be caused by several things, one such thing as a valve not contacting the seat fully to transmit it's heat through the seat to the head.

Older engines used the same material as the head (usually cast iron) for the seats. When unleaded fuel came out the factory had to step up it's game and install hardened seats to make the cylinder heads live in the new, unleaded fuel enviorment. Without lead to insulate, lubricate, and cushion the valves the seats life was dramatically cut.

I have never seen, heard, or read about detonation taking material off the cylinder walls of any engine and I have been an NHRA Crew Chief (with two National Records in Competion Eliminator) and have been building engines for over 40 years, I actually laughed when I read what you wrote.

Really just wanted to know if anyone had done any engine swaps on the Connie, did not want to try to be schooled by weekend warriors, remember, a little bit of knowledge is dangerous! Dave
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby Dan Szwarc » Fri Oct 07, 2011 9:02 am

Let's not discuss valve seats or the 430 and just stick to the topic at hand: tips to install a 460 into a slabside

Start another thread if you want to talk about lead and valve seats.
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby TonyC » Mon Jul 30, 2012 10:22 pm

Agreed--no need to start a war of words here, tempting as it is, much as I love to question this guy's "authority"--but not here.


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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby 65linctdot » Sun Jan 26, 2014 12:57 pm

I also want to swap out the 430 motor and install a 460 or something better. Please keep us posted if you found any solutions?
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby bd94s10 » Wed Dec 08, 2021 2:36 pm

1970ls5, what did you end up doing with your '65? Did you swap the drivetrain? Fast forward 7-years or so can places like Devious Custom, Detroit Deviant and even Little Shop Mfg make parts for easy engine swaps. Jeff at Devious Customs is seemingly swapping a drivetrain every month these days in a 60s Lincoln.

https://www.deviouscustoms.com
https://detroitdeviant.com
https://www.littleshopmfg.com

There are the links for you or anyone else.

Note: in my '64 "Project Smuggler's Blues" I pulled the engine and had it rebuilt. I also had the trans rebuilt. The car has been super reliable. I also purchased a '65 Lincoln that has been super reliable. I like to remind people as much as I like a motor swap the factory drive train can and is super reliable. You can also get them to stop leaking with using a more modern rear main seal (avail on eBay), etc.

My '64 build thread: https://www.thelincolnforum.net/phpbb3/ ... 42&t=51010
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Re: WANT TO INSTALL A 460 385 SERIES IN MY 65' CONTINENTAL

Postby bd94s10 » Wed Dec 08, 2021 2:39 pm

1970ls5, what did you end up doing with your '65? Did you swap the drivetrain? Fast forward 7-years or so can places like Devious Custom, Detroit Deviant and even Little Shop Mfg make parts for easy engine swaps. Jeff at Devious Customs is seemingly swapping a drivetrain every month these days in a 60s Lincoln.

https://www.deviouscustoms.com
https://detroitdeviant.com
https://www.littleshopmfg.com

There are the links for you or anyone else.

Note: in my '64 "Project Smuggler's Blues" I pulled the engine and had it rebuilt. I also had the trans rebuilt. The car has been super reliable. I also purchased a '65 Lincoln that has been super reliable. I like to remind people as much as I like a motor swap the factory drive train can and is super reliable. You can also get them to stop leaking with using a more modern rear main seal (avail on eBay), etc.

My '64 build thread: https://www.thelincolnforum.net/phpbb3/ ... 42&t=51010
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