12 v ignition power source for pertronix

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mge825y
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by mge825y »

A question for Dan on checking the voltage to the Flame-Thrower ignition coil on my 63 LCC...

After several surprises, I've come to realize that the PO didn't always set things up correctly. So am going back through the car and double-checking a few things (And yes, my belief system has been shattered) If I want to confirm that the power wire to the coil by-passes the pink resistor wire, is the correct idea to (a) start the car, (b) use a multimeter set to DC volts, spear the wire powering the coil with the red test lead and ground the black lead and look for 12 volts?

Just want to make sure I'm on the right track

Mark
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by action »

In stock condition the voltage to the coil is about 5 volts. Twelve volts runs to the coil and then gets stepped down by a resistor wire. (The pink wire) After the current flows through the resistor wire and makes it to the coil the voltage is about 5 volts.

The Pertronix coil can handle 12 volts. If that coil has been correctly connected, there will be 12 volts at the Flame Thrower coil. So your statement you posted is correct.

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2006 Lincoln Navigator Limited 5.4l 3V
1996 Lincoln Mark VIII 2DR Coupe Diamond Anniversary 4.6l DOHC, 4R70W, 3.07
1970 Continental Mark III Triple Black 460 4v, C6, 2.80 (Used for Woodward Dream Cruise or just generally stored in Michigan)
1966 Lincoln Continental 4DR Convertible 462 4v, C6, 3.00
1966 Mercury Park Lane 4DR Breezeway 410 4v, C6, 2.80
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by mge825y »

Thank you Action!
Mark in Charlotte
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by Solid »

I'm trying to finish up squaring away the wiring nightmare that the hot rod shop left me with, and in the process concluded it was time to ditch my relay by the battery and bypass the resistor wire instead. On 61/62 this should be identical, and 63 should be similar except for the relocated fuse box.

Pardon the mess here. They created a dangerous unmanageable CF of unfused wiring that penetrated through rough cut grommet-less holes in the firewall, so I put in new heavy gauge wire for my modern style fuse panel inside the car (stereo, seat heaters, etc) and wires routed under the carpet towards the trunk that aren't completely secured yet. The dangling pink wire is the original resistor wire. It appears more orange where it has picked up dirt or shown more age, and it actually has "resistor wire" printed on it in small black text. As you can see, it has a bullet end and just pulls out of the back of the harness plug going into the firewall. Instead of cutting the harness, I created a new yellow wire with bullet ends and routed it along the underside of the dash where the vacuum hoses for the climate control etc are routed. Since the pink wire has been chewed on or otherwise assaulted at some point, I'm going to heat shrink over it to render it inert and zip tie it to the harness.
IMG_6122.jpeg
All the P clips were left loose on the instrument panel side of my dash by the idiots, so it's also a mess at the moment, but I was able to find that this unused connector end had 12V during the start and run positions and just put a bullet into it. EDIT: MAYBE NOT SO MUCH.
IMG_6123D.jpeg
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by MikeinNP »

Hi All - I just installed the Pertronix ignitor and the Flamethrower coil on my 67. Right now I'm running the coil right off the battery so I can get the newly rebuilt engine running and that's going well. The dash and ignition console are currently out of the car and while I have that all out I'd like to figure out how to replace or bypass the pink resistor wire. I think I see it attached to the electrical connector that would plug into the ignition switch and it appears to be co-connected with another two-color wire. This is all factory and no mods have been made at this point.

What should I be looking for and what's the recommended approach to bypass the resistor wire?

Thanks all!

Mike - Seattle, WA
Mike Bishoff - Normandy Park, WA
1967 Lincoln Continental - WIP :)
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by Emas9420 »

Just to put in my 2 cents... I hooked my flamethrower 12V source directly to the starter solenoid. coincidentally, its the same place where technically the resistor wire connects to . so you could just cut the old resistor wire and hook this to the starter solenoid and call it a day.. no need to find a switched on 12v source.
- Emanuel
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by action »

65-falcon-wire-harness-on-65-mustang-rally-pac-wiring-diagram.jpg
Attached is a 1967 Falcon primary ignition wiring diagram. All FLM products will be similar for the period prior to 1968. The difference after that is the ignition switch has more functions.

The ignition switch gets 12V+ from the heavy lug on the starter relay. The same lug that the battery + cable is attached.
A small wire goes from that terminal to the ignition switch.
When the ignition switch is turned to the start position, 12v+ goes from the ignition switch ("s") to the starter relay "S" terminal on the stock starter relay. This is a red/blue wire.
This engages the relay to send 12v+ to the starter in a heavy cable. AND 12v+ to the coil B terminal. This is a small brown wire at the relay "I" terminal to the coil B terminal.
When the engine starts and the ignition switch is moved to the run position, this cuts off power to the starter relay. (and no 12v+ power to the coil) Power from the ignition switch now goes through a small wire to the coil B terminal. That small wire to the coil from the ignition switch has a section of pink resistance wire. This is to step down the voltage to the coil. The stock coil can not handle 12 volts for long periods of time.

To get a full 12 volts to the coil, controlled by the ignition switch is to run a regular wire parallel to the wire from the ignition switch coil terminal to the B or + side of the ignition coil.

OR you could wire up the (Flame Thrower) coil to the heavy battery terminal on the starter relay. The coil would be energized all of the time with ignition on or off. The electronics would keep the coil turned off. This is easy to do however poses some risk as that circuit to the coil has 12 v = all of the time. (Just like the ignition switch)
Frankly most of the time with a well maintained ignition system, the "Flame Thrower" coil is not needed. The stock spark plugs will only need under 15,000 volts at the top end. The stock coil is good for 18 to 20 thousand volts. A coil that is capable of 40 thousand volts or more could be needed if the spark plugs are oil fouled or old and worn or the gap is excessively wide. However all of those conditions are outside of a well maintained engine.

Action
Phoenix - Yeah, it's hot, however it's a dry heat
2006 Lincoln Navigator Limited 5.4l 3V
1996 Lincoln Mark VIII 2DR Coupe Diamond Anniversary 4.6l DOHC, 4R70W, 3.07
1970 Continental Mark III Triple Black 460 4v, C6, 2.80 (Used for Woodward Dream Cruise or just generally stored in Michigan)
1966 Lincoln Continental 4DR Convertible 462 4v, C6, 3.00
1966 Mercury Park Lane 4DR Breezeway 410 4v, C6, 2.80
Emas9420
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Re: 12 v ignition power source for pertronix

Post by Emas9420 »

action wrote: Wed Sep 13, 2023 4:00 pm 65-falcon-wire-harness-on-65-mustang-rally-pac-wiring-diagram.jpg

Attached is a 1967 Falcon primary ignition wiring diagram. All FLM products will be similar for the period prior to 1968. The difference after that is the ignition switch has more functions.

The ignition switch gets 12V+ from the heavy lug on the starter relay. The same lug that the battery + cable is attached.
A small wire goes from that terminal to the ignition switch.
When the ignition switch is turned to the start position, 12v+ goes from the ignition switch ("s") to the starter relay "S" terminal on the stock starter relay. This is a red/blue wire.
This engages the relay to send 12v+ to the starter in a heavy cable. AND 12v+ to the coil B terminal. This is a small brown wire at the relay "I" terminal to the coil B terminal.
When the engine starts and the ignition switch is moved to the run position, this cuts off power to the starter relay. (and no 12v+ power to the coil) Power from the ignition switch now goes through a small wire to the coil B terminal. That small wire to the coil from the ignition switch has a section of pink resistance wire. This is to step down the voltage to the coil. The stock coil can not handle 12 volts for long periods of time.

To get a full 12 volts to the coil, controlled by the ignition switch is to run a regular wire parallel to the wire from the ignition switch coil terminal to the B or + side of the ignition coil.

OR you could wire up the (Flame Thrower) coil to the heavy battery terminal on the starter relay. The coil would be energized all of the time with ignition on or off. The electronics would keep the coil turned off. This is easy to do however poses some risk as that circuit to the coil has 12 v = all of the time. (Just like the ignition switch)
Frankly most of the time with a well maintained ignition system, the "Flame Thrower" coil is not needed. The stock spark plugs will only need under 15,000 volts at the top end. The stock coil is good for 18 to 20 thousand volts. A coil that is capable of 40 thousand volts or more could be needed if the spark plugs are oil fouled or old and worn or the gap is excessively wide. However all of those conditions are outside of a well maintained engine.

Action
This is correct, in the lincoln the pink wire actually starts/ends at a plug right next to the solenoid. you can trace it is very easy to see.. you could technically also tap into this brown wire directly as this brown wire comes directly from the ignition switch.. I connected directly to the I post.. but you could do either or.
- Emanuel
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